NetNews Offline 2/NetNews Offline Volume 2.iso/news/comp/sys/amiga/misc-part1/4212

Internet Message Format | 1996-08-05 | 7.8 KB

Path: coranto.ucs.mun.ca!gnoel
From: [e-mail] (George Noel)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: The March Amiga?
Date: 4 Feb 1996 10:49:25 GMT
Organization: Memorial University of Newfoundland
Sender: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <4f22vl$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: plato.ucs.mun.ca

In article <[e-mail]>,
Eric Szulczewski <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>GP> It's time for us to 'get real' and take each step for what it is. We need
>GP> to quit looking for some conspiracy afloat in the Amiga Technologies camp
>GP> to 'rape and pillage us'.
>
>When has anything like that ever been said?  I've floated some rather

Others here have said they are only putting out the A1200+ to get quick
money on old technology.

>GP> We need to quit calling the computer 'crap' and
>GP> start making positive and constructive suggestions.
>
>I only said that the 600 and 1200 were crap.  And I have made "positive
>and constructive suggestions" in regard to the 1200, namely abandon the
>true low-end system and go for a low-to-mid-end that wasn't in an
>all-in-one so that a user would be encouraged to upgrade in an easier
>manner.  I never heard from Kittel about that.

Yes you have, he has said this is out of the question due to higher
production costs, which I agree with.  There needs to be 3 models, the
lowend, the midlle-ranged and the highend.  I think the A1200+ will fit
into the middle-range somewhat, now whether or not they supply expansion
slots is another question, I doubt it, but would be appreciative.

>You've made three specific instances where you feel that we
>non-AT-boosters have criticized AT.  Let's go through each of those:
>
>1) "...they are out to rob us...":  What Paul said was that the 1200 is
>too expensive for the purpose for which it was brought out.  The price
>was too high to be considered a low-end system.  He was not charging AT

See my comment above about this.  As for the current price, in my recent
Amazing Amiga, the A1200/3.1 OS/AGA/2MB RAM/NO HD is going for $599US with
the AT Magic Pack plus 25 other disks of software from the mail order
company.  For a 170MB Hard Drive included it is $195 extra.  Maybe non
Amiga owners wouldn't pay this much but I would have had the A1200+ not
be scheduled to come out in May. Price all depends on how you view the
product I guess.

>2) "...what they are pushing is 'crap'...":  Mea culpa.  The first time
>I specifically referred to the 1200 as crap was when George said,
>"You're crapping on the 1200".  I thought I'd be, literarily speaking,
>cute about what he said.  That didn't work, and may have been too

Don't change things to your benefit, the reason why I said "crapping"
on the A1200 was because you had called it crap in a previous post of yours.
That was what got me in on that thread, especially seeing Team Amiga at
the end of your signature.

>strong about my own feelings about the 1200.  Just to clarify, I feel
>that the 1200 is too weak, too technologically outmoded, too difficult
>to beef up, and not as good a starter system as some here say it is.

Granted yes, it could be better.

>3) "...we could care less about trying to help get the Amiga back into
>the limelight it once held.":  Gary, if we cared less, why would we
>bitch so much?  I don't think you've ever been in the military.  It's

Bitching too much doesn't get heard and sometimes is counterproductive,
especially when done in the wrong way.

>given up.  Consider Gilles and Kittel the drivers of the AT Bus, and
>us as the passengers.  You're up there reading the map and saying,
>"This is a nice scenic route, and you're driving quite well."  Paul,
>Byron, and myself are in the back going "Why don't you take this
>particular shortcut?  It'll get us there faster."  Same destination,
>different approaches.  Let's not bitch with each other so much about

Different approaches yes, but whose to say if its a tour bus or a
charter?  How about everyone else on the bus wanted to see the sights
before heading into town?  I don't think the AGA chipset has gotten too
much exposure or wasn't utilized very well, the new approach gives it a
second chance before heading onto new territory.  If it makes money,
gains new support then that is a plus along the way.  There is no
since continuing with the A1200 expansion problems as obviously nothing
is going to be done about it.  The A1200+ might be a bit better and if
it is and the price can lower to enable it to become the new lowend then
it would be ok. If you really want to make sure we have a good lowend,
offer your suggestions when the time comes for a lowend PPC Amiga.

>the way we travel, because the wheel isn't in our hands.  But we can
>make damn sure we annoy the drivers...

To the point where they either dismiss you (tell you to get off the bus)
or ignore you (turn on the stereo and put earphones in).

>Yes, the "penis substitute" remark may have been a bit out of line, but
>sometimes it takes a lot to get through to people.  I do adjust my

HAR!

>approaches, and my poor fevered brow decided this would be the best
>approach on George.  Notice that my last response to him was in the

Why to try and scare me off or into a flame war?

>GP> >At the mment, AT seems to be letting IBM cash in on the Surfer pack.
>
>GP> Now maybe some will see why the US lawyer type got to keep his job?
>GP> Remember the sig "egoff.ibm.net"?

With the cooperation that AT needs with IBM and Apple for the development
of the Power Amiga, I see no problem with this, along with IBM being equated
with business and serious business, it will only improve the image of the
Surfer pack.

>thing that Escom could do, but maybe they should have diverted from
>those practices a little and experimented with the laws of consumer
>demand.  I'm not finding fault, just acting with hindsight.

I think this is what the pre-Christmas and Christmas sales was.  They now
have some figures to work with, let them do the math and do the adjusting.

>That's an awfully snide remark given to a well-expressed valid
>criticism, Gary.  You've got to admit that $800 is a little expensive
>for a 1200, no matter what software it comes with.  It's just a matter
>of plain consumer economics, especially in NA, where the power cult is
>king.

Considering some are trying to put out a box with no drives in it for
$500 that connects to a network to do everything and paying for that network
in the process, basically a Smart Terminal, the $800 doesn't seem too
bad when you got a floppy drive and software to use right away without
having to be connected to anything yet still having the option of
finding your own Internet Service Provider and using the Internet/WEB
software that came with that $800 machine.  Where did you get $800
anyways?  Is that Canadian or US dollars?


>No, but what they do have is more important, and that's what Paul's
>talking about:  AT's marketing strategy for the Amiga.

Another point no one has brought up.. do you think they are going to
market something which is technically not theirs?  I mean AT had no say
in the stock A1200.  They came up with the Surfer pack and are designing
the A1200+, made the deal with Microvitec for the monitors, put together
the Magic Pack and made arrangements for the Q-drive.. don't you think
once they are ready they will market these moreso as it is their own ideas?

>Speaking of long-term preparation, Gary, I was wondering:  if the PPC
>comes out here without a marketing push and without a mass marketer in
>place before release, will you criticize then?

I know I would, that would be long enough to get their act in gear and to
take the Amiga seriously and know how to market it.  I think things will
fall into place before then.

>* Offline Orbit 0.75a *

Are you getting this feed through a BBS or a University or an Internet
provider?

-=*George*=-